What are the real differences, and why? I've heard vegetarians will abstain from meat, but for most, eggs and milk are ok, whereas vegans will abstain from all animal products.

Is that about right?

If so, I'm interested in learning about the different reasons behind each.

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"We live in symbiosis with our planet. If we destroy our planet, we destroy ourselves." - Mugs

"Staying young requires the unceasing cultivation of the ability to unlearn old falsehoods." - Heinlein

Mugs, how new is this forum? I like it!

I am a vegetarian, for about a year and a half now, though I still eat fish every once in a while, so I guess pesco-vegetarian is the proper term. I also eat a bit of dairy and take fish oil supplements, though I am going to switch to hemp oil once my current bottle runs out.

A true vegan doesn't use anything animal, including other aspects of their lives, such as clothing and body care products. Most won't even use honey.

As it is possible to live a completely animal free life, we are evolved omnivores, making it a much easier life to incorporate a little bit of animal into your diet. I will use dairy products, but I choose organic whenever possible, or locally produced. There is definitely an ethics side of the dairy industry that is shameful to say the least.

As a last thought, I think humanity is evolving towards a vegetarian lifestyle. The number of vegetarians grows every year, faster than general population growth. The benefits of a vegetarian lifestyle are also becoming clear: better health for yourself and the Earth.

Hiya, Toothdust!

Fairly new - within the last half a year, anyway. The more people post, and about more and varied topics, the more others will find their way here and do the same. Hasn't reached critical mass, yet, but it will.

About the same for me, but without the supplements (just a multivitamin).

I think you're right, if for no other reason than the fact that an acre of land can feed about 10 times more people when it's used for produce than when it's used for either grazing, or even alfalfa production. If I remember correctly, chickens are more than twice as efficient, at around 4 times. Still, that's a lot of wasted land.

I agree it's better for the land. As I've switched towards more vegetarian intake, particularly organic foods, my thinking has improved, as has my overall level of energy. I'm certainly feeling a lot better than I used to!

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"We live in symbiosis with our planet. If we destroy our planet, we destroy ourselves." - Mugs

"Staying young requires the unceasing cultivation of the ability to unlearn old falsehoods." - Heinlein

Agreed! I also gave up watching television about a year and a half ago, so its hard to say how much my diet change has improved my clarity of mind, because they both occurred at roughly the same time. I would say though that the lighter, healthier meals most certainly didn't hurt it.

I have noticed, though, since eating a vegetarian lifestyle that I am able to operate on much less sleep at night, about 6 hours usually, and I have longer sustained energy throughout the day as well. I don't get drowsy mid-afternoon like I used to.

Hey, missed this forum the first time around, but I hope it's not too late to join the critical mass!

Figured I'd throw a few more details onto the pile:

First off, there's a bit of a range of what people consider permissible as far as animal product use among vegans, though most everyone agrees it's impossible to avoid all use in the real world. Car tires are usually made with dairy-derived ingredients and tend to be used as the classic example of how striving for 100% Pure Vegan Purity™ is the path of madness. Slightly (but not much) more controversially, my cats still eat meat and I have no interest in trying to switch them to a vegan diet.

I'm actually pretty far out on the lax end. I tend to break a lot of rules outside of the house. I'm not really interested in forcing my friends to buy vegan margarine when I'm eating at their house; a little butter isn't going to kill me. I tend to have a don't ask don't tell policy about ingredients at restaurants, too.


As far as reasons, mine haven't really changed between my being vegan and my being vegetarian: killing unnecessarily remains the real moral sticking point. The big change was just learning more about the realities of commercial livestock agriculture, particularly the realization that actively culling the herd is an essential part of the whole process.

Further out on the spectrum, others hold that any domestication whatsoever is inhumane and should be abolished. I believe PETA goes so far as to say that domestic species such as dogs that are no longer properly adapted to live in the wild should be prevented from reproducing until they go extinct.


Oh, I almost forgot:
In case you're interested, there's a brand of algae-derived omega-3 supplement called V-Pure. It's a bit more comparable to fish oil in that it also contains EPA, which is lacking in hemp and flax.